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 Entire forum ➜ MUDs ➜ General ➜ Looking for a true AD&D or 3e D&D codebase or server
Looking for a true AD&D or 3e D&D codebase or server

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Posted by Prophet   (1 post)  Bio
Date Sat 23 Nov 2002 10:05 PM (UTC)
Message
I'm looking for a codebase that the "rules" are based on D&D not just the theme. I've seen about 3 but can't get any response from the owners. Does anyone know of one?

AD&D or 3rd edition, doesn't matter which. I'm just tired of having to tear down everything and basically start from scratch.
Thanks
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Posted by Meerclar   USA  (733 posts)  Bio
Date Reply #1 on Sun 24 Nov 2002 01:57 AM (UTC)
Message
As far as I know, there isn't a codebase thats actually designed in stock form to be based directly on the AD&D rules. Every mud I've ever seen that was even remotely close to them was extremely heavily modified. If you are lucky enough to find one, I wish you the best in running it, meanwhile, DoT is reasonably easy to rewrite to match the AD&D rules, though I personally wouldn't use 3rd edition since I think its crap.
Meerclar - Lord of Cats
Coder, Builder, and Tormenter of Mortals
Stormbringer: Rebirth
storm-bringer.org:4500
www.storm-bringer.org
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Posted by Modnar   (7 posts)  Bio
Date Reply #2 on Mon 03 Feb 2003 03:45 AM (UTC)
Message
glarhg! 3rd edition is my favorite so far (i'm no newbie to dnd). i'd have to say its easily superior to Adnd. anyway, prophet, if your interested in developing a mud like this, let me know, i've wanted to work on one for a while.
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Posted by Darisan   (57 posts)  Bio
Date Reply #3 on Sat 31 May 2003 05:11 PM (UTC)
Message
I'm interested too, that would make three coders... Wanna?
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Posted by Trommerse   (5 posts)  Bio
Date Reply #4 on Sat 31 May 2003 09:35 PM (UTC)
Message
Some people who got used to AD&D say 3rd sucks because they've played AD&D too long to give it up. 3rd ed's best feature is the simple rules, younger kids can get into it easier and older people who don't want to spend all day learning something don't have to. 3rd ed expanded the players base like it or not.
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Posted by Jennan   Canada  (11 posts)  Bio
Date Reply #5 on Fri 15 Aug 2003 01:58 AM (UTC)
Message
This sounds interesting. Im not great at coding, but i do have access to a registered version of area editor.

Need some more help, let me know. I'm in :-D
Jennan
cleddyf@yahoo.com

World of Eyron
Arch Wizard

Yahoo IM: cleddyf
MSN: cleddyf@telus.net


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Posted by Modnar   (7 posts)  Bio
Date Reply #6 on Mon 25 Aug 2003 03:00 AM (UTC)
Message
Actually, i've put some thought into it, and decided i don't have the time for such a large project. My main stumbling block would be recreating the turn based system with all of its sublties intact. Each room would have to be a grid. Since the average 3rd ed. character can move 6 steps in a turn (or 24 if they run), each room would have to be huge, to hold a single combat in it. The thought of drawing everything out with ascii characters horrifies me :P

Also, it would have to be done in turn based combat. Imagine accidently walking into a huge room, where a fight was happening, with many participants. Now, you don't want to fight, just walk to the other side, but since you are present, you would have to roll initiative and take your turns just like everyone else. the annoyance factor would be prohibitive.

if someone came up with a workable design, i could help, but i can't think of one.
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Posted by Thrawn   USA  (7 posts)  Bio
Date Reply #7 on Mon 25 Aug 2003 12:02 PM (UTC)
Message
Unless you coded a room - sort of like SWR's space - that would allow you to move freely, and after you attack you get a flag that dissapears once it is you turn. I wouldn't know how to code this - I specialize in VB. I did make a DnD thingy in VB, but it sucked a little.

So yeah, probably modifiying SWR would work. You'd need a lot of work on it.
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Posted by David Haley   USA  (3,881 posts)  Bio
Date Reply #8 on Mon 25 Aug 2003 06:04 PM (UTC)
Message
It seems to me that trying to make a computer game match exactly AD&D is a bit odd. I understand perfectly making a MUD's rules match AD&D's rules, the character generation, skills, combat, etc... But, I don't understand why you would want to constrict a computer game down to a pen and paper level.

The way I see it, AD&D has and always has had some "over-simplification", simply because some things are just too unwieldy with pen and paper. Many people say that 3rd Edition's greatest strength is to make things even simpler. I don't know, I've never played it, but I just don't like it in theory due to some of the things they did concerning limitations, player races and whatnot. But anyways...

The problem with any kind of grid-combat system is that those aren't meant to be used in a room-based environment. If I'm on the west-most "square", and the fellow to my west is on the east-most "square" of his room, why can't I stab him? Why do I have to change rooms, even though he's right next to me? And when I end up in the room, presumably on the east-most side, would I have to tediously walk across the room, square by square?

I think that the problem there is that you're extremely rapidly approaching the limits of not computer games, but text-based computer games. You're starting to talk of 3D (or at least 2D) combat maneuvers, the representation (to the player, not in-game) of which is quite simple in a 3D world, but mind-boggling in a text environment.

If I were you, I would choose which rules of AD&D are not feasible with only text, and which rules can be adapted to better suit the power of your environment.

For example, one thing that computers do very well is number crunching. All those simplifications that AD&D makes can be removed because you no longer have to roll the dice yourself. Even in the case of initiative, a player walking across the room wouldn't feel it, because the actions would all perform seemingly instantly; the computer only determines which order. If you have turn- or round-based combat, you probably want the whole world time to be round-based, if anything for sanity reasons. But really, a player probably wouldn't really need to "feel" the initiative, it would all be done behind the scenes.

So, to summarize, I think that before you launch into a large-scale AD&D-rules-server project, you should do an analysis of which rules you should ditch because of text-only limitations, and which rules you should "improve upon" due to the power of having a program do all the "dirty work" of dice-rolling for you.
David Haley aka Ksilyan
Head Programmer,
Legends of the Darkstone

http://david.the-haleys.org
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Posted by Darisan   (57 posts)  Bio
Date Reply #9 on Tue 26 Aug 2003 05:31 PM (UTC)
Message
How about this... You don't make it turn based, however class, race, leveling, experience, character creation you take from AD&D... That way those familiar with AD&D can easily play, and those who aren't can learn quickly. However, you don't make movement and combat turned based. That would just be horrible! Quite frankly, I wouldn't want to play a mud thats turned based, kind of defeats the purpose of a mud :)

I would help code, I can... Just an idea.
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Posted by Modnar   (7 posts)  Bio
Date Reply #10 on Wed 27 Aug 2003 01:08 PM (UTC)

Amended on Wed 27 Aug 2003 01:26 PM (UTC) by Modnar

Message
ksilyan - I mostly agree.
The room thing we could fix, now that i think about it, we could just make every room a 5 foot square, and give the players visibility of X number of rooms in any direction, depending upon the lighting/see in the dark ability they have.

All of the 3D stuff would be very hard, (climb, fly, etc.) but i don't think it can just be removed. Drawn out, a cavern that has a 15 foot ceiling might look like this:

Legend:
* - Empty space
P - You
A - Ally
M - Monster
T - Stalactite
S - Stalacmite

floor    Air      Ceiling
*******  *******  ******T
**AS***  ****T**  *******
***SM**  ***S***  ***P***
**S****  *******  *******

So with your fly spell you could float over the stalacmite, and shoot arrows or something at the monster, then move a # of rooms equal to your movement/5.

Would this be too confusing?

Also, as to turn based/real time, i might have thought of something. Whenever a melee starts, all participants drop into turn based combat. anyone who is in the area and doesn't want to participate has a command or option (bypass) which removes them from the combat. Of course, they can only use this if they haven't yet acted in the combat yet. So people in the area when it starts or people who walk in but just want to pass through can use the bypass to not get sucked in.
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Posted by Darisan   (57 posts)  Bio
Date Reply #11 on Fri 29 Aug 2003 07:52 PM (UTC)
Message
You could run into big problems, say its turned based;

1st person attacks
2nd person attacks
3rd person goes to the bathroom (ooc)
4th person has to wait

1st person cant attack
2nd person cant attack
3rd person gets back from bathroom and attacks
4th person attacks

1st person goes idle
2nd person is getting really mad
3rd person is getting really bored
4th person leaves the game

A problem like this could occur very often, it just wouldn't work...

:(
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Posted by David Haley   USA  (3,881 posts)  Bio
Date Reply #12 on Sat 30 Aug 2003 05:51 PM (UTC)
Message
You could simulate turn-based combat by having a player's typed command queue up, and it is only processed when it's the player's turn. And if the player has nothing to process at his/her turn, well, too bad for them. :) Or, you could have the player default to "attack my target" if they didn't type anything, which is probably more fair.

This way you wouldn't have the problem of someone getting up and walking away. Besides, halting the game like that is simply contrary to the whole notion of a real-time game. You would get many more problems than simply someone getting up and halting one fight... your whole server notion of time would just be extremely weird.
David Haley aka Ksilyan
Head Programmer,
Legends of the Darkstone

http://david.the-haleys.org
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Posted by Modnar   (7 posts)  Bio
Date Reply #13 on Sun 31 Aug 2003 02:38 PM (UTC)
Message
> You would get many more problems than simply someone
> getting up and halting one fight... your whole server
> notion of time would just be extremely weird.

oh gawd, i didn't think of that. You can't very well have one person who thinks its noon and one who thinks its midnight.

The game really could be done real time. 6 seconds is a round, so your character takes the first battle action, then you have 6 seconds to think about your next move. if you knew what you wanted to do you could type lots of commands very fast, these would queue up. (sound familiar so far?) unlike muds know, you could move about rooms during combat (since each room is 5ft), if you cast a spell or take any other action you don't get your default weapon attack, and you would be able to view and change the queue of commands waiting to be executed.

wouldn't be so bad, really
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Posted by Gidianhi   (1 post)  Bio
Date Reply #14 on Wed 12 Nov 2003 10:54 PM (UTC)
Message
I realize this is really old, and maybe nobody cares...but I was wondering why nobody everybrings an 'rl-ish' perspective into things like this. Ever been in an RL fight? It's NOT turn based, and you CAN move about the room, but that rarely happens in a fight. Once the fight starts you pretty much go toe-to-toe until it's over. Nobody's climbing the walls, and other odd things.

D&D HAS to be turn based. Otherwise who would play?

Bob goes
Bob goes again, and again, and again.
I smack bob, and take my turn.
The DM gets pissed, takes away your turns, and the monsters take 5 turns in a row killing you.

You want turn based d&d online, go to one of the virtual tabletops to play. Otherwise yeah, pick the rules your playing with (5'movement squares in a fight psh), and drop the rest. Imagine actually walking across the town in RL time, if everyroom was only 5' long. *boggles*

G
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